Classic Replay: Debating Penal Substitution - Steve Jeffrey, Greg Boyd, Alan Molineaux & David Bish

00:00

Christians believe that Jesus' death on the cross provided the atonement for sins. But in what way? Advocates of the penal substitution view hold that God punished the Son, instead of us. Others argue this is an unjust way of viewing the crucifixion and prefer the 'Christus Victor' view, that Jesus defeats the powers of evil on the cross.

In this classic replay, Steve Jeffery defended Penal Substitution, while Alan Molineaux questioned it. We also had contributions from American theologian & church leader Greg Boyd in defense of Christus Victor and UK leader Dave Bish in defense of Penal Substitutionary Atonement. First broadcast in 2013

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Released on 27 Dec 2022

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select * from `brand_pages` where `brand_pages`.`brand_id` = 2 and `brand_pages`.`brand_id` is not null and ((not exists (select * from `brands` where `brand_pages`.`brand_id` = `brands`.`id` and `brands`.`deleted_at` is null)) or (exists (select * from `brands` where `brand_pages`.`brand_id` = `brands`.`id` and `is_active` = 1 and `brands`.`deleted_at` is null))) and `is_active` = 1 and `brand_pages`.`deleted_at` is null

Bindings	0: 2 1: 1 2: 1
Backtrace	app/Models/Traits/ContentFamilyTrait.php:18 app/Models/Brand.php:104 view::components.sections.sub-menu-brand:29 vendor/laravel/framework/src/Illuminate/Filesystem/Filesystem.php:110 vendor/laravel/framework/src/Illuminate/View/Engines/PhpEngine.php:58

ContentFamilyTrait.php#18premier950μs

select * from `audio_series` where `audio_series`.`brand_id` = 2 and `audio_series`.`brand_id` is not null and ((not exists (select * from `brands` where `audio_series`.`brand_id` = `brands`.`id` and `brands`.`deleted_at` is null)) or (exists (select * from `brands` where `audio_series`.`brand_id` = `brands`.`id` and `is_active` = 1 and `brands`.`deleted_at` is null))) and `is_active` = 1 and `audio_series`.`deleted_at` is null

Bindings	0: 2 1: 1 2: 1
Backtrace	app/Models/Traits/ContentFamilyTrait.php:18 app/Models/Brand.php:105 view::components.sections.sub-menu-brand:29 vendor/laravel/framework/src/Illuminate/Filesystem/Filesystem.php:110 vendor/laravel/framework/src/Illuminate/View/Engines/PhpEngine.php:58

ContentFamilyTrait.php#18premier950μs

select * from `article_series` where `article_series`.`brand_id` = 2 and `article_series`.`brand_id` is not null and ((not exists (select * from `brands` where `article_series`.`brand_id` = `brands`.`id` and `brands`.`deleted_at` is null)) or (exists (select * from `brands` where `article_series`.`brand_id` = `brands`.`id` and `is_active` = 1 and `brands`.`deleted_at` is null))) and `is_active` = 1 and `article_series`.`deleted_at` is null

Bindings	0: 2 1: 1 2: 1
Backtrace	app/Models/Traits/ContentFamilyTrait.php:18 app/Models/Brand.php:106 view::components.sections.sub-menu-brand:29 vendor/laravel/framework/src/Illuminate/Filesystem/Filesystem.php:110 vendor/laravel/framework/src/Illuminate/View/Engines/PhpEngine.php:58

ContentFamilyTrait.php#18premier750μs

select * from `podcasts` where `podcasts`.`brand_id` = 2 and `podcasts`.`brand_id` is not null and ((not exists (select * from `brands` where `podcasts`.`brand_id` = `brands`.`id` and `brands`.`deleted_at` is null)) or (exists (select * from `brands` where `podcasts`.`brand_id` = `brands`.`id` and `is_active` = 1 and `brands`.`deleted_at` is null))) and `is_active` = 1 and `podcasts`.`deleted_at` is null

Bindings	0: 2 1: 1 2: 1
Backtrace	app/Models/Traits/ContentFamilyTrait.php:18 app/Models/Brand.php:107 view::components.sections.sub-menu-brand:29 vendor/laravel/framework/src/Illuminate/Filesystem/Filesystem.php:110 vendor/laravel/framework/src/Illuminate/View/Engines/PhpEngine.php:58

Podcast.php#137premier420μsselect * from `brands` where `brands`.`id` = 2 and `brands`.`deleted_at` is null limit 1

Bindings	0: 2
Backtrace	app/Models/Podcast.php:137 view::components.sections.sub-menu-brand:32 vendor/laravel/framework/src/Illuminate/Filesystem/Filesystem.php:110 vendor/laravel/framework/src/Illuminate/View/Engines/PhpEngine.php:58 vendor/livewire/livewire/src/ComponentConcerns/RendersLivewireComponents.php:69

BrandPage.php#22premier430μsselect * from `brands` where `brands`.`id` = 2 and `brands`.`deleted_at` is null limit 1

Bindings	0: 2
Backtrace	app/Models/BrandPage.php:22 view::components.sections.sub-menu-brand:32 vendor/laravel/framework/src/Illuminate/Filesystem/Filesystem.php:110 vendor/laravel/framework/src/Illuminate/View/Engines/PhpEngine.php:58 vendor/livewire/livewire/src/ComponentConcerns/RendersLivewireComponents.php:69

BrandPage.php#22premier500μsselect * from `brands` where `brands`.`id` = 2 and `brands`.`deleted_at` is null limit 1

Bindings	0: 2
Backtrace	app/Models/BrandPage.php:22 view::components.sections.sub-menu-brand:32 vendor/laravel/framework/src/Illuminate/Filesystem/Filesystem.php:110 vendor/laravel/framework/src/Illuminate/View/Engines/PhpEngine.php:58 vendor/livewire/livewire/src/ComponentConcerns/RendersLivewireComponents.php:69

ContentFamilyTrait.php#18premier760μs

select * from `brand_pages` where `brand_pages`.`brand_id` = 2 and `brand_pages`.`brand_id` is not null and ((not exists (select * from `brands` where `brand_pages`.`brand_id` = `brands`.`id` and `brands`.`deleted_at` is null)) or (exists (select * from `brands` where `brand_pages`.`brand_id` = `brands`.`id` and `is_active` = 1 and `brands`.`deleted_at` is null))) and `is_active` = 1 and `brand_pages`.`deleted_at` is null

Bindings	0: 2 1: 1 2: 1
Backtrace	app/Models/Traits/ContentFamilyTrait.php:18 app/Models/Brand.php:104 view::components.sections.sub-menu-brand:38 vendor/laravel/framework/src/Illuminate/Filesystem/Filesystem.php:110 vendor/laravel/framework/src/Illuminate/View/Engines/PhpEngine.php:58

ContentFamilyTrait.php#18premier760μs

select * from `audio_series` where `audio_series`.`brand_id` = 2 and `audio_series`.`brand_id` is not null and ((not exists (select * from `brands` where `audio_series`.`brand_id` = `brands`.`id` and `brands`.`deleted_at` is null)) or (exists (select * from `brands` where `audio_series`.`brand_id` = `brands`.`id` and `is_active` = 1 and `brands`.`deleted_at` is null))) and `is_active` = 1 and `audio_series`.`deleted_at` is null

Bindings	0: 2 1: 1 2: 1
Backtrace	app/Models/Traits/ContentFamilyTrait.php:18 app/Models/Brand.php:105 view::components.sections.sub-menu-brand:38 vendor/laravel/framework/src/Illuminate/Filesystem/Filesystem.php:110 vendor/laravel/framework/src/Illuminate/View/Engines/PhpEngine.php:58

ContentFamilyTrait.php#18premier640μs

select * from `article_series` where `article_series`.`brand_id` = 2 and `article_series`.`brand_id` is not null and ((not exists (select * from `brands` where `article_series`.`brand_id` = `brands`.`id` and `brands`.`deleted_at` is null)) or (exists (select * from `brands` where `article_series`.`brand_id` = `brands`.`id` and `is_active` = 1 and `brands`.`deleted_at` is null))) and `is_active` = 1 and `article_series`.`deleted_at` is null

Bindings	0: 2 1: 1 2: 1
Backtrace	app/Models/Traits/ContentFamilyTrait.php:18 app/Models/Brand.php:106 view::components.sections.sub-menu-brand:38 vendor/laravel/framework/src/Illuminate/Filesystem/Filesystem.php:110 vendor/laravel/framework/src/Illuminate/View/Engines/PhpEngine.php:58

ContentFamilyTrait.php#18premier790μs

select * from `podcasts` where `podcasts`.`brand_id` = 2 and `podcasts`.`brand_id` is not null and ((not exists (select * from `brands` where `podcasts`.`brand_id` = `brands`.`id` and `brands`.`deleted_at` is null)) or (exists (select * from `brands` where `podcasts`.`brand_id` = `brands`.`id` and `is_active` = 1 and `brands`.`deleted_at` is null))) and `is_active` = 1 and `podcasts`.`deleted_at` is null

Bindings	0: 2 1: 1 2: 1
Backtrace	app/Models/Traits/ContentFamilyTrait.php:18 app/Models/Brand.php:107 view::components.sections.sub-menu-brand:38 vendor/laravel/framework/src/Illuminate/Filesystem/Filesystem.php:110 vendor/laravel/framework/src/Illuminate/View/Engines/PhpEngine.php:58

Setting.php#20premier400μsselect * from `settings` where `setting_key` = 'web_donation_link' limit 1

Bindings	0: web_donation_link
Backtrace	app/Models/Setting.php:20 app/Helpers/Settings.php:6 vendor/laravel/framework/src/Illuminate/Filesystem/Filesystem.php:110 vendor/laravel/framework/src/Illuminate/View/Engines/PhpEngine.php:58 vendor/livewire/livewire/src/ComponentConcerns/RendersLivewireComponents.php:69

App\Models\Brand: 9Brand.php#?
App\Models\Podcast: 7Podcast.php#?
App\Models\Setting: 6Setting.php#?
App\Models\PodcastEpisode: 5PodcastEpisode.php#?
App\Models\BrandPage: 4BrandPage.php#?

section-podcast-player #TyD75JixIY6TW8NfT0UX: array:5 [ "data" => array:10 [ "podcast" => App\Models\Podcast {#2065 #connection: "mysq...

_token: OFAkhEXxbsP1p8G0WC8gnumcSaPUzua62PNabF9F

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	Date ↕	Method	URL	Data
#1	2025-06-21 10:21:31	GET	/unbelievable/podcasts/episodes/classic-replay-debating-penal-substitution-steve-jeffrey-greg-boyd-alan-molineaux-amp-david-bish	64 42 31 1

Classic Replay: Debating Penal Substitution - Steve Jeffrey, Greg Boyd, Alan Molineaux & David Bish

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